LUVTruck.com

Still having a heck of a time getting the right rockers for my heads. Ihave tried 3 sets and they still all sert on the edge of the retainers, My friend from the machine shop is helping me out by getting sets in and sending them back if they don't work. I have gotten one that go on the studs easy enough but still rest on the backside of the retainer.
We are now thinking I need togo to a little longer pushrod. Mine are +100's and the +150's just barely touch. Gonna try +200's this evening.
Hoping the geometry won't be that far off.
I broke the cam in with my other ones I ground on but they are still hitting the bevel of the retainer is why I need new ones.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

definitly sounds like push rods that are too short.

what kind of roller to stem tip contact are you getting? is it even?

A.j.

_________________
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykgDNjeTa0g

Quick and dirty method is to use a marker and cover the top of the valve stem. Then install the rocker on for the valve and set the lash. Then roll it over a couple of times. Then you take the rocker off and see where the marker rubbed off. If it is in the center, you are pretty close...

_________________
If you think no one cares, try missing a couple of payments...



FIAA!

SFPP!

Actually Itried that with a felt tip but I never could really see any mark.
That last one i put on. i watched the tip at 3 different points aftre turning the engine by hand. The 150 with on max lift the centeer of the roller pion looked somwhat below center amd when th evalve was closed it was above center .
i think i can go to 200 and stuill be on the safe side and not be to far down the stem at max lift. I know 300 was way too much. it put the roller center about an 1/8 from the edge of the valve stem at max lift. Did solve my clearance on the retainer though.
The 150 just had a very slight white paint spot on the roller by the trunion housing after Ipainted the top of the retainer with some white paint to see if it touched. It also had a small indentation on th epaint on the retainer.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Tried some +200's and that is what I am gonna go with and see what happens after I reset the valve lash. Looks like the one I tried is gonna be right. Geometry looks good but still a little clearance but not much.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

You are not alone. I built a 428 sbc shortblock for a guy last year. He installed his own top end. Truck ran in the dirt drags and did pretty good for no suspension work on it. He built a new one this year himself, it is not as fast, go figure. My bud got the old one, and I tore it down yesterday. The rockers were stuck to the edges of the retainers, had to pry them off...

And even though I told him to use a .062 thick head gasket, the ones on it were .042, and the pistons were slapping to head, (not the valves) this loosened the head bolts by stretching them causing water to seep in...

_________________
If you think no one cares, try missing a couple of payments...



FIAA!

SFPP!

Woof, what a deal. I don't remember what fel pro gasket I used but it seemed thicker than stock. I am hoping my rockers will be fine. I am gonna set the valves and run it a bit and then take a rocker off and see if there is any wear marks on the retainers, if so . I can shave the rockers just a tad and think it will be ok.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Well I am lost as what to do next. I went to the machine shop and talked to my other bud who builds dirt track motors. He suggested not to run the 200's yet and get a pushrod checker. The pushrods or 90 dollars and the special order lenghts for +200 and up are 116. I am not going to set my valves and then find out the rockers are rubbing the retainers still.
He suggested taking a LED light in the dark and shine through the rocker and hold a black card behind it and see if the light comes through ans shows a gap between the rocker and retainer.. Well it didn't when the valve is completely closed but shows a gap when it is opened a little and then gets a good gap when full lift.
As usual when the valve comes back up and closes there is no light meaning no gap. Guess I will either go for a very expensive set of rockers which are thin but strong or take a chance and go to a longer pushrod. I might do the same check with a +300 and see if there is a gap and also check the geometry again.
This is really starting to be another pain. So much for getting to the track this summer it looks like.

AARGGGGGGGG

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

It's very possible they set the installed height to high.
Are they stock length valves or long?
Did they use +.050 keepers?
What diameter springs?
Is there any shims under the springs, if so how much.
To what pressure, seat and nose are the springs set to.
If it's on the lower side, or you have .050 in shims, you can go to standard or -.050 keepers.
Just some things to look to. Never had this problem with cams in the .700 lift area. Just have to get the right combonation of pieces.

_________________
The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

My spings are supposedly 1.800 installed height. The valves are +100 so that is why they told me to use +100 pushrods. There is a large round rubber thing under the springs that they set on. My deck height is 950 I believe. Heck my lift is only 541 and 552. I am thinking they used to big of a retainer. 1.500 . My springs are 1.460.
I have never had these kind of problems before on stock engines.
Don't think I used too thick of gasket with the aluminum heads.
Should have just let my machine shop do all the buying and work instead of me finding the heads and such.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

What rockers are you using again? Are your heads taller then stock (aluminum)?

I agree you are having some abnormal problems here.

_________________
1978 pro street step/side 455Buick, 4sp,4.11s, 31/18.5s

yes aluminum. I am trying pro comp now but have had crane and PRW
i tried a +300 last night and they were fine. No rubbing at all I even did the paint on the retainer trick and not a mark on the retainer or rocker.
The geometry wasn't bad Went from just above center to past center 1/3 of the way down to the exhaust side.
My machine shop guy is ordering me an adjustable pushrod touse. We are thinking a +250 will be just perfect but want to make sure before we order any pushrods. He can also get them in .25 increments as well as 50.
With the +300 I can get a folded piec of paper ove the retainer past the rocker. Am curious what +250 does.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Well i got a Manley pushrod checker and it looks as if the +300 is what I need. I actually had .017 clearance between the checke and the pushrod at base circle.
I have heard that lengthening a pushrod will give more lift. Sounds reasonable but my machine shop guy doesn't think so. Even at that he said turn the engine over to max lift and measure my spring gap. I should have at least .060 combined gap of all coils. I guess my cam has a lower base circle than I thought needing a longer pushrod.
Hope my vallves have enough clearance on the piston. I would assume I would feel it when I turn the motor over by hand if one would touch.
Anyway maybe I can ge on with the program again.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Who ever sold you those 1.460 springs, was wrong. There are several that are smaller in diameter that would be better and no rocker problems. Particularily with that cam and projected rpm.
Retainer diameter should be smaller than the spring diameter. ie a 1.460 spring will have a retainer diameter of approx 1.440. What type of spring seat, "rubber"? would be a no - no. Should have spring cups against the alluminum. Check the installed height, to be sure. That folded piece of paper will not be enough clearance for a running engine. We always used a paper clip, which is about .060.
Look at a Comp cams 26915

_________________
The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

It looks like rubber but is cup shaped. How do I measure the spring height. I guess just because the seller said 1.800 doesn't mean it is right.
I have the +300's ordered. Wonder if I need to get new springs and everything. Geez I hope not. Was gonna get it fired back up tomorrow hopefully.
The heads came assembled. I couldn't understand why he used the 1.500 retainers. Maybe I should get smaller ones. Better safe than sorry. I know the clearance problem is were the rocker starts to curve down. A smaller retainer would definately not hit on the edge, There is plenty of clearance on the top before the bevel of the retainer. Just the outside edge of the retainer is were all my problems are.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Thanks Ol Rob, you gave some excellent information here, nothing helps like experience does it?
always good to hear from you!

dusty scjconv

i think that light at the end of my tunnel is a train.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

The light at the end of my tunnel is usually the Proctologist.

_________________
1978 pro street step/side 455Buick, 4sp,4.11s, 31/18.5s

Yaaaaa, at least my spring cup is metal. Whoopie something was right.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!

Now the hard part, measure from the inside of the cup, where the spring sits to where the spring meets the retainer. That is the installed height. Most likely it will be easier to measure from the seat where the cup sits and the cups are most likely .060 thick.

No thrill better than a prostated exam.

_________________
The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!