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Hey guys!? I know a V8 swap into these trucks is very popular but what about a v6 swap? Now I'd like to do the V8 swap but with gas prices being unpredictable I was looking into more power but good fuel economy also. Plus with money being tight it would be cheaper to do the v6. My question is what v6 would you recomend that I could drop in with little or no modifications. Thanks for all your help guys!

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Bowtie 4 life!!


94 Z28
01 Monte Carlo SS
54 Belair (under construction)
80 LUV (Work in progress)

You pretty much have to do ALL the same mods (and costs) to the truck to put a V6 in vs a V8 (just a little more front to back room is all you save and a little weight). I still kick myself 20 years later for not adding the extra 2 cylinders. And for fuel economy, well, with my 231 Buick, turbo 350 tranny and the stock rear end, I get 6 miles to the gallon. A 4.3 with a 700R4 would be a better combo which wasnt available when I did mine, but my S10 SS has that combo, tons of power but I am lucky to get 17 miles per gallon in it.

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RIP R.J.B.

6 mpg? my 454 blazer gets that, the luv always gets atleast 10 even with the 33's and pretty much the same drive train 3.8 v6 th350 stock rear

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No luv right now =(

Ok, well your 33's are probably close to twice the diameter of my tires. At 60 MPH my truck is running close to 5000 rpms (hence the crappy mileage). Your truck goes around twice as far in one revolution due to tire size then mine does. So that would be about 12 MPG and with the extra weight of the tires, kicks it down about 2 miles per gallon which IMO makes us getting the same mileage. I had a 454 Xtra cab dually, and it got 12 MPG. I could be wrong but that is the way I see it.
And yes, this is all

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RIP R.J.B.

Holy crap? 6 mpg? I figured with the truck being small and lightweight that the mpg would be better. That's why I thought about the v6 swap.

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Bowtie 4 life!!


94 Z28
01 Monte Carlo SS
54 Belair (under construction)
80 LUV (Work in progress)

I think TITLED needs to tune his truck. The RPM comparison isn't really logical. A lot of variables, but an engine is generally most efficient at maximum torque. The amount of power required to maintain a set speed and acceleration rate used are the main determining factors for fuel economy. You can set up a V8 for economy or power. Might as well set it up for a V8 if you are going to spend the money and time so you can change the engine later if you want.

There will be mounts available for the 4.3 Chevy SB V6 with TH350 or 700R4 in about two weeks. As are the V8 mounts, these also will be bolt in mounts. For pics of V8 and some good information see http://www.photobucket.com/V8luv and http://www.photobucket.com/V8Courier

The gas mileage is dependant on the level of engine build, transmission and final drive ratio. I've built street V8 mini trucks of all kinds and the best was over 20 mpg with a 1/4 mile in the low 12's. A balance V6 setup can get maybe another 2mpg over a balance V8, however the power difference is noticable.

I've been envolved in engine swaps for over 45 years including magazine vehicles.

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The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

been noticing alot latlely that alot of people refer to tilted as titled but back on topic.
you might be better off spending your swap time from drive train swap to just a tranny and rearend a five speed and some different gears plus a well tuned g180 would give you the milage. if you beefed up the engine a little i hear they can thump pretty hard.
just a thought

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No luv right now =(

Then maybe I'll just build up this engine if I can get more power out of it. I didn't think they sold a performance kit for these.

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Bowtie 4 life!!


94 Z28
01 Monte Carlo SS
54 Belair (under construction)
80 LUV (Work in progress)

In most cases you will not get the performance from the 4 cylinder to match a stock or mild V8, 283, 302, 305, 327 or 350. With a properly set up V8, auto and rear gear change you will get as good of milage. As you increase the power of the 4 cyl you will lose mpg. You need to weight the cost of building up the 4 cyl, five speed, rear gear, etc against finding a good SB Chevy engine and 700R4 or 4/5 speed trans. The V8 and trans will not work as hard as the 4 cyl and therefore last a lot longer. The potential for more is there. The SB V6 would also follow these parameters.
All of the parts you will need to do a conversion will be about $ 1,000 thats for quality bolt in parts and proper installation. Rear gear change would be the same. You and a buddy, can do the swap in less than 4, if you get all the parts ready. To simplify wiring run a stock altenator (bracket available). If you use a neutral safety switch (HIGHLY RECOMMENDED) pull the start signal wire back into the cab, connect it to the switch on the shifter. Run a new heavier gage wire (purple) to the S terminal on the starter from the switch on the shifter.

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The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

tilted is correct.


I average just alittle more than that (TH350C). The problem is buicks dont like winding real high for a long time....

I recently swapped to 3:73s in the rear and it was a night and day difference in the milage.... went from 6 to almost 16 with the reduction in RPM, 75MPH is about 4200RPM now.

700R4 is the best option if you plan on running a Buick V6.

A.j.

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V8 it is. I recalled a friends company switching they're small fleet of drlivery trucks from v8's to v6 powered truck and lost more money in the operation of these vehichles because the trucks broke down more and used more fuel when loaded down. Nothing beats a V8! I'm from the old school so I should have known.

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Bowtie 4 life!!


94 Z28
01 Monte Carlo SS
54 Belair (under construction)
80 LUV (Work in progress)

Thank you!!!!
My truck is tuned properly, its the tranny/rear end gear ratios that are killing my mileage. The one time I raced my truck, I could blow people off the line but about 1/4 of the way down the track I was done and just watch people go by me. Yep, need a tranny with at least 4 gears to be worthwhile. Glad you came to your senses and are going with 8 Pistons!!! I dont ever remember hearing anyone go "Man I wish I would have put in a smaller motor"

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RIP R.J.B.

Same here tilted! Thanks for opening my eyes. I'm serching for my v8 now.

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Bowtie 4 life!!


94 Z28
01 Monte Carlo SS
54 Belair (under construction)
80 LUV (Work in progress)

well if thats what you really think......... LOL i wouldnt trade my buick V6 for anything..... especially since the Buick GN TSM cars are running 9 sec 1/4ers in a full weight, stock block, stock head car with 20 year old tech. pop one of those motors in a 2600lb Luv? pure insanity. Once im at that point.... i will easily challange any v8 to a race and still drive home with the A/C on....... yea buicks are expensive.... but somebody has to dare to be different.

I totally know what you feel about 1/4 blast with the stock rear!!! those gears and the tractor torque of the buick ....... I was 60ft'ing just about anything short of a back haved race car........ but after that....... it was 6500 rpm of slowness. Try going to 3.73s........ that buick will supprise you with the way it will pull on the highway when mashed! it wont lauch quite as well - but a 2800 stall converter got me back to serious 60fts.

Heres what I have learned about ideal buick set up......

3.8 - 4.1 buick V6,
700R4 but it must be a POLICE or HIGH PERF 700r4 (needs those specific calibrations) to count.
S10 rear with 3.54s

it will rip out the hole and cruise like a dream.

Try it............I dare ya.

A.j.

Good to be out of the pen.

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Let's talk facts and leave out the fiction.
NO! 3.8 Buick V6 will make the same power per cubic inch as a small block Chevy!
A stock 3.8 2bbl has a rated Hp of approx 138. The early sixties 283 2bbl was approx 160. Given the same weight, trans and gearing, the V6 just barely got better millage.
GM killed the Buick V6 and only brought it back when they needed a small engine in a hurry, during the early seventies trumped up fuel crisis.
Some will jump and mention the Grand Sport "Turbo" V6 cars. Lets put that turbo on the 283 and hang on to your panties. I've built a few turbo cars, along with positive displacement blown. I built some 2.3 Fords with a 4;71 blower that probably would give the turbo V6 a run.
The best production V6 head will not even flow what the double hump 283-350 production head flows. The Buick V6 was never meant to be a performance design.
To get the same power from the V6 as the V8, you will have to work the V6 harder shortening it's life. The early V6's were rough at idle and low speed due to thier firing order. Yes the newer even fire are a lot better.
I've done over a thousand engine swaps, been indirectly invovled with more than that many. Since 1965 and I've had a large number of the V6 conversions, come back and say they wish they would have gone a V8. Now lets add that most of the ones who didn't, a V8 even the SB Chevy would not have fit without butchering the vehicle. You do want to be comfortable when driving on the street.
Now as to size, the V6 Buick is approx 1 1/2" wider at the exhaust flange, 1" taller overall and only approx 2" shorter from the rear of the furthest back head to the hub of the water pump. Remember the V6 has the timing chain, cover, dist out in front of the block. It's weight is close to the Chevy, less than 100 pounds difference.
The engine in that 9 second car wouldn't last 20,000 miles on the street, even in a 2600 pound LUV truck. I've had V8 mini trucks that had over 250,000 miles on the engines and they were 11 second with street tires.
Now as to the Chevy 4.3 V6. It is a 305 with the 3 & 6 cylinders removed. However it will respond to all of the tricks that you would use on a SB Chevy. Again you are still dealing with an old adage that, "There is no substitute for cubic inches"
Why did Chevy dump the Buick V6. This isn't something recent, it was done in the late seventies. I had a copy of the external diminsion blueprints from Chevy engineering. You can also find most of the diminsions in the Chevrolet Power book. they even made a splayed valve head for the V6 Chevy engine altho it's still a cut down V head design.
Don't get me wrong there are places where the Buick V6 makes sense and I've recommended them when appropiate.
Stall converters will cost you some milage depending on the stall.
In another light!
When it comes to factory production parts, how many recall the Z-11 or Mark IV heads from Chevy, Pontiac Ram Air V, not IV, V. Chrysler Stage II and III heads, Olds W series, and I recall a Buick GS V8 head and there are more rare finds.
Just think how much fun you could have with that kind of engineering and manufacturing capability.

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The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

been readin this one for a while so i thought i'd throw my 2 cents worth in...
i have a 231 buick v6 and other that high rpm miss i am happy with it, it has plenty of torque to break the tires loose any time i want and with my 45 mile commute to work i drove it one time fueled up before i left and fueled it up when i got back to find i only used about 3.5 gal of gas thats about 26 mpg!!!
now there are a few things i would change i would definately go with a 4 spd tranny cause i dont like it cruisin at 4000 rpm and it gets too hot (240 deg!!!) other than that the only reason why i intend on changin to a 327 is because i can get my hands on one that already built sittin on about 550 hp before the bottle!!!! just cant pass it up!

pinks here i come!!!!


p.s. side note: dr_frankenstien56 good to see you back on the board was startin to wonder if something bad happened pm me

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zyanug
75 luv stepside... Work in progress
76 fleetside 350hp 1968 327cu
"No replacement for displacement!"
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[_@l__l__@_]***

Maybe you;re getting gas added by them aliens. There was a movie, with Walter Mathau and Carol Burnett, where Walter and his son would add gas to a neighbors Volkswagen, who was always boasting about his milage. Got real funny when they started siphooning and the guy was yelling at the mechanics telling him nothing was wrong.
There are people that are happy with thier V6's. Thank god we don't all like the same thing, colors, designs, body shapes, I think they were known as Stepford Wifes. Althou? Hope no wives read this.
Truthfully driving habits are a big factor in gas milage. Racing from light to light doesn't help gas milage much. I can attest to that from old experiance, when gas was 18 Cents a gallon, sometimes less with gas wars. You just had to watch for the water hose or the lid off of the tanks when they were washing down the driveways. Big fine if they got caught, was'nt much consolation as you were cleaning it out of your tank though.
You didn't say what year truck, you might try to round up a higher ratio rear gear. I vaguely remember, not sure that there was a 3.36 rear that would go in. A lock up converter helps a little, a 700R4 would definitely help, however it takes little more power to operate than a TH350. That was a major factor why they all had 4/5 speeds for years. Americans got lazy with thier auto and many had to relearn or attempt the art of driving a clutch.
Did an early 71 Datsun with a 283 TH350, with a 3:23 rear change, for a then older guy. Anybody over 40 was old then, little did I know as the years went by. He ran the stock size wheels and tires and he got in the high 20's. What he liked most was he had the power for passing and going up the grade to lake Havasu. Even with his boat the milage didn't change much. Don't read much into that, his boat was a aluminum fishing boat. Originally we thought he had something big and were wondering why he was trying to pull it with a Datsun.
It was amazing that they were converting mini trucks into motor homes. Roll-A-Long was one. The second V8 mini I did was an older retired woman who had a Courier. Boy were those things dogs with the 4 cyl, I wonder how many of them got tail ended by bikes taking off from a light? Gas milage was not good, too much weight and wind resistance.
A lot depends on why, where, objective, and what you can afford in doing engine swaps.

Sorry for all the antidotes.

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The light at the end of the tunnel, may just be a train coming!

To start off Old Rob those 15-18 cent gas days were sure the days weren't they.
Now as for some of the rest i built a 82 S-10 with a 85 Caprice 305/700R4 combo the motors then were 9.5 comp. then and i installed a marine cam in it out of a 305 8.5 comp. marine motor rated at 225 HP the truck had A/C that i made work stock tires 3.73 gears and got 30-32 mpg on the highway with the cruise that i installed it was a good truck but i sold it to fund another project.I built a 78 Chev stepside with a stock 70 Eldorado 500ci engine th400 and a 2.73 rear it would get 24-26 highway (see where this is going) i have built maney a car /truck (though maybe not as many as Old Rob lol) and believe that any engine,trany,rear end combo. will work if you make the combo to fill your need.Meaning that a setup for mileage is not the setup for drag racing and vise verse there is always a variable in there as well.
When i first built my truck it had the stock rear and size tires but i built it with a 283/4spd and it did just what i built it for and got pretty good mileage if i kept my foot out of it and the rear held up to but i left it stock.Sure it was buzzing at 4200 rpm at 60 but 283s don't mind being there(short stroke)and when running-it hard i shifted it at 8200 rpm's all this and i drove it for 2 years before i built it to it's present state.
The point is build what you want but put some thought into your intended purpose and you will be happy.Look for advise and help but ultimately it is your choice.
Buicks by the way are mileage motors and not rpm motors.
My suggestion for the beginner low budget guy is start with a 283,305 or 327 motor th 350 or better the 700R4.

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1978 pro street step/side 455Buick, 4sp,4.11s, 31/18.5s

I'll take you up on that .............. want to pit a buick vs a SBC? An All LUV drag event? so that the playing field stays level? can we throw in the Big block guys too?


A.j.

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