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PostPosted: Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:07 am 
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Location: Bridge Creek, OK
Hello all. This is my first post. I bought a 1980 4x4, 4cyl gas, 4speed from a high school kid. it has typical high school kid fix-ups. It did run, he drove it to taco mayo, where I picked it up at. The carb was loosey goosey, so I tightened it up. Fuel leaking, fixed that. Now it is getting spark, crisp blue/white spark, The accelerator pump is not pumping fuel but I primed it with gas. It should start. firing order is CCW 1-3-4-2 Right? My question is, is there any other little odd trinkit wire fuse sensor switch that might be there that I dont know about? and yes some of the vaccumn lines are off and cut but it should still fire up. This weekend I gotta put my head on mine 78', then I'm going to get the 80' driveable. Thanks for all the help.

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 3:05 pm 
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Ok, It's been a couple days and no replies. :( Any way. I took off the cap, coil, rotor, wires off the 78' that I know are good and now I have NO spark. changed plugs, they were blackened severly. Swapped everything back to orginal with the new plugs and still no spark. I fixed the carbuetor and is working fine, it had loose mid-bottom section screws and alot of orfices clogged. The 78' cap was wired CCW 1-3-4-2. Oh it did back fire once! Any IDEAS? THANKS in advance. Lee

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 7:32 pm 
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ok, got it to spark, but not all that sparky. I touched it, not THAT hot, and not that bright. I looked at the 78' cap placement and duplicated the same on the 80'. After about three rotations it back fires slightly. TIMING? I dont know timing procedure on luv, but I did touch plug when it fired and stop turning it over and the bug was at the #1 terminal!?!? CCW 1-3-4-2? I remember the rule F.A.S.T. Fuel it as fuel, A it has air, S it somewhat has spark not all that hot tho, T timing I have NO IDEA!! Is there something to hinder the spark at the plug? The coil is good, the points are set at .011, any thing else? What exactly is the timing procedure? Thanks again, Lee

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PostPosted: Sat Oct 11, 2008 7:53 pm 
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Points at .011? It has been a while but I thought point gap was supposed to be more like .018? Someone with a book handy chime in on this please? To narrow of a point gap would explain most of what you describe.

Also it sounds a little like the truck I had that someone had put together 180 degrees out. You might try swapping the plug wires on the cap. Basically just swap the wires directly across from each other. 1 to 4 and 3 to 2. If it ran the way you have it now though, I doubt this is the problem.

As a test you can jumper a wire across from the battery to the + side of the coil too. If the resistor is dead/dying or something is wrong with the relays for the resistor bypass system it might help it start. Just don't run it long like that or it will eat the points rather quick. A few minutes is probably ok, a half hour is pushing it.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 12:44 pm 
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I just finished installing the head on the 78'. Runs like a brand new top! :D Now it's time to figure out the problem with the 80' 4wd. I'll try swapping the wires and setting the points gap higher. I never thought of by-passing the resistor, but when you mentioned it my buddy in high school had to by-pass his to get it started then take off the jumper and it ran fine. weird?! Anyway I'll go mess with it for awhile. Thanks agian Lee

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 12:51 pm 
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If you have to bypass the resister to start your rig then either the factory bypass don't work or as is most likely the coil is week and needs direct voltage to start as the starter is drawing voltage away from the coil.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:22 pm 
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Ok the by-pass trick did not work so the coil and resistor is good. Rewired the cap backwards and it fired up. Tried to turn distribtuor 180 deg. but the slot wont allow it. It wont start RIGHT up but will start with some persuation. I got #1 piston up and the rotor bug is pointing in the 4-5o'clock position, the #4 wire with the cap wired backwards, also the timing marks align on the pulley and block. Tried wiring it back normal and no start up. Can anyone tell me the correct timing procedure. I finally drove it around the yard! I never-the-less found out it did not have good brakes as I lightly ran into the shop. I want it start like my 78', just barely turn the key and it starts right up. Thanks again Lee

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:26 pm 
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best thing i can reccomend is pull off cap mark where bug is pointing pul distributor out and turn it 180 degrees put it back in then you can adjust from there

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zyanug
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:28 pm 
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sorry jus thought of more

pull dist out just enough to where its not engaged with cam at bottom and turn rotor bug 180 from where mark is

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zyanug
75 luv stepside... Work in progress
76 fleetside 350hp 1968 327cu
"No replacement for displacement!"
___/__l____
[_@l__l__@_]***
TILTED wrote:
Boobies!!!!! 8O


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:31 pm 
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I tried that gently and it wont go in. should I try a little bit harder?

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 2:38 pm 
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can you tell me what the bottom of the dist looks like

is it a sproket or like a flat screwdriver?

if its a sproket you may have to turn it a tooth or two one way or the other

if its like screwdriver it will only go in one way

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zyanug
75 luv stepside... Work in progress
76 fleetside 350hp 1968 327cu
"No replacement for displacement!"
___/__l____
[_@l__l__@_]***
TILTED wrote:
Boobies!!!!! 8O


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:38 pm 
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It's the screwdriver style. The flat tip is off-center. Couldn't see how I was to turn it 180 deg.? It will turn over and start but runs bad.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:51 pm 
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At this point in time I would start from the begining. I would pull the valve cover, get the crank to TDC with both #1 valves loose, reset the dist to #1 and re-wire the cap.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 4:59 pm 
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some how firing order got messed up thats why it would start when you swapped plug wires around i dont know firing order off hand but if you can wait till i get off work ill look at the parts truck i got and see what it is

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zyanug
75 luv stepside... Work in progress
76 fleetside 350hp 1968 327cu
"No replacement for displacement!"
___/__l____
[_@l__l__@_]***
TILTED wrote:
Boobies!!!!! 8O


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 12, 2008 8:16 pm 
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I decided to mess with the timing tomorrow. I've been browsing the site for timing posts and found quite afew. I think I know what to do or look for to get the timing set. #4 is what timing is set from not #1 like I thought. Funny lil' 4 bangers :lol: So in the mean time I took off the exhaust manifold to fix leak and clean it up. Also took off the intake to take off all the smog equipment. All the smog equipment was clogged and not working anyways. While the carb is off I'm gonna clean it a lil bit better. Also have to look at the brake issue now that the wife saw the dent in the shop. :oops: Also ordering book tomorrow. Any ways people thanks for all the help and I'll continue to visit and interject some conversation in posts that I know a lil' bit about. Any other help to this post will be greatly appreciated. Thanks again Lee

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:18 pm 
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i've got a manual here at the house and a timing light if you need it firing order is 1-3-4-2 points gap is .016-.020 i set my timing off the number one plug which is what my manual says at 6 degrees btdc idling at 900 rpm hope this helps

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:46 pm 
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OK, Update on the timing issue. I got the manual from NLUV and looked at the timing procedure pages. What I came up with is 1. If I wanted to time the motor with a timing light I should be 6 deg BTDC hooked to #1 wire. My truck is not running so I'm not able to do this. 2. The only procedure I found to set timing from scratch is from #4 compression with valves loose and the timing gear, inside motor, pretty much straight up and down. What I found on the 80' motor is this; no matter if #1 or #4 is on compression, the timing gear inside motor is NOT straight up and down, about 2 and 8 o'clock respective position, with the rotor pointing towards the opposite way, ie:#1 comp stroke rotor point towards #4 on cap, and #4 comp stroke rotor point towards #1 on cap.

The distributor looks to have never been tampered with, no hammer tracks on roll pin or shaft. So some one couldn't have installed the shaft on backwards. Is there a way the motor is not a 80' model but a earlier or later? The block says G180. BY THE WAY the cam sprocket mark is never pointing up on either compression stroke and not timed with the crank pulley mark. Did someone install something incorrectly??? What is the best way to get everything back in TIME? I'M SO CONFUSED HELP!!! Thank you again Lee

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 8:55 pm 
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The cam timing mark is set to #4 with the mark on the cam behind the sproket. The ignition timing can be checked at either #1 or #4, makes no difference. If #1 is on compression stroke then #4 is on exhaust position and vise versa. Timing mark will show there in either position. You are correct, set timing to 6 degrees at a slow idle, (900 rpm or less).


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 9:52 am 
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Sounds like you need to go over the cam timing. The distributor gets 180 degrees out by someone putting the cam sprocket on 180 degrees out. It sounds a little like yours might even be a little off from 180 degrees out of time. The distributor shaft only fits one way and the position of that is controlled by the crankshaft.

On the 80 LUV I fought this problem on I just swapped the plug wires and called it good. It was exactly 180 degrees off and would not run any other way.

Here is an old post of mine that describes how to check the cam timing.

viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11064

Hope that helps!

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95 Isuzu Trooper Daily Driver
86 Isuzu Trooper reliable backup
77 LUV 2wd stock beltway blaster (resting)
79 4x4 LUV project: 2.6L, 5spd, 31s (eventually)

MEPR: Man, my 4x4 makes all other LUVs look good :lol:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 2:26 pm 
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Like 800 said, get your cam timing correct first.

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