LUVTruck.com

phpBBV3 Message Board
It is currently Mon Sep 24, 2018 8:59 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 137 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 7  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Isuzu Pup 5 Speed Swap?
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 12:01 am 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:31 pm
Posts: 4
Location: Eastern Oregon
I've been told that an '80s Isuzu Pup 5 speed trans (gasoline engine / 2 wheel drive) is a "bolt in swap" with my '80 Chevy Luv 4 speed (gas engine 2 wheel drive) Anybody have any info on this? I've located an 84 Isuzu Pup 5 speed trans, but want to make sure before I buy it. I was even told that an Isuzu passenger car 5 speed from that era is the same.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 3:36 am 
Offline
PITA Old Fart

Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:33 am
Posts: 2286
Yes the tranny will bolt up - but the tranny output splines are different.

You will need to get the driveline (or at least the front yoke and/or the rear end pinion yoke) from the donor vehicle with the 5-speed to make it all work. The u-joints are exactly the same size, but the Luv driveline's front yoke is a 10 spline to match up with the stock 4-speed's output shaft, and the 5-speed has a totally different spline configuration.

Also, the rear yoke of any driveline for a vehicle with a 5-speed and a stock Luv's rear-end are a different spaced bolt pattern, so it wouldn't be a bad idea to just swap the rear-ends while you are at it.

The only thing you will have to mod is you will have to put the stock Luv springs on the newer rear-end to keep your wheels centered in your rear wheel wells, and you will have to cut, re-locate, and weld the little tab that your rear brake line connector block bolts to over to the opposite end of the newer rear-end housing.

You will also need to look at how the clutch and e-brake linkage works to make sure it all hooks up right - but it is a real great conversion to give your Luv better performance and better gas mileage.

Have fun and good luck!


Last edited by tumwatertaz on Tue Jul 03, 2007 2:32 am, edited 3 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Isuzu 5 speed conversion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:12 am 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:31 pm
Posts: 4
Location: Eastern Oregon
Thanks for your post!
So it IS possible even without changing the rear end? I'm no mechanic and the less fuss I'm going to have to do, the better.
I'm new on this forum so is it possible to email you directly for more info should I need it?
Thanks,
Curt


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 5:17 pm 
Offline
PITA Old Fart

Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:33 am
Posts: 2286
You can change front yokes on your old Luv driveline to match the output shaft of the 5 speed tranny providing the one in the vehicle you are getting the 5 speed tranny from has replacable u-joints. Some don't and that can really cause a problem. If it has the non-replaceable type in the front yoke, you might get lucky and the rear yoke has replacable u-joints. If not, you will have to locate another same-length driveline with the same splines on the front yoke as your 5 speed, or you should be able to change the pinion yoke in your old Luv rear-end to the newer one from a newer Pup to match the rear yoke in a newer Pup driveline, if you're still sure you don't want to swap rear-ends

A tranny from an 83-87 Pup will work and the driveline should have replaceable u-joints, but you still might reconsider the rear-end swap. The Pup rear end is a lot tougher - and Luv rear-ends are notoriously weak, and a lot have a pretty low gear ratio that cuts down your top-end speed and really kills your gas mileage. Switching to a 5 speed will help, but not nearly as much as adding a newer rear-end too will.

BTW..Just holla at me here if you need me. This kind of stuff is what this site is for. And there are plenty of folks around here that know way more about these little trucks than me - so you will want to give them a chance to possibly add their input anyway.


Last edited by tumwatertaz on Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:09 am, edited 3 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Isuzu 5 speed swap
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2007 11:40 pm 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:31 pm
Posts: 4
Location: Eastern Oregon
Thanks for all your help on this. Maybe the Pup rear end is a good idea and the diesel truck probably uses the same rear end anyway? The main reason I'm doing this is BECAUSE of the Luv rear end gears being so low and how the motor is winding so high at speeds above 55. Maybe just the rearend swap would do the trick for me?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 4:54 am 
Offline
PITA Old Fart

Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:33 am
Posts: 2286
I believe the diesel Pup rear-ends and trannys are different than the gas engine Pups, so I would suggest that you narrow your search to only gas powered trucks.

If you can get the parts cheap enough for you to afford to do both the rear-end and the tranny, then I would recommend you do both if you can.

It really isn't that difficult of a swap, and it sure makes one heck of an improvement to any Luv IMHO.

I did both in one day with the help of a couple of local guys. The only real mod we had to do was to relocate that little tab that's welded onto the new rear-end housing for the brake line junction box to bolt to, which took all of about 10 minutes to cut off and replace at the other end by weldng on a short piece of thin narrow flat-stock steel with a small hole drilled in it.

If you have access to a decent wire-feed welder, then you should be able to do the whole thing reasonably easy. If not, then you can still get it done cheap by loading the newer rear-end up and taking it to any welding place after you measure everything and mark where it needs to go.

When I did mine, I used the rear-end and tranny out of an 87 shortbed Pup with a 2.6, and the clutch linkage in my '78 stepside was the same, both rear-end's e-brake setup matched, the drivelines and trannys were both the same length, and the new tranny's shifter went through the same exact spot in the floor.

One of the guys that helped me did the same 5 speed tranny swap in his old 79 Luv that he used to have, but he used the complete newer driveline with his old Luv rear-end by changing the pinion yoke in his old Luv rear-end to the newer one so that the newer driveline's rear yoke would bolt up to it. (He was unable to swap rear-ends because the rear-end in the newer Pup that he was getting his parts from was shot, but the luckily both pinion yokes matched up exactly, and a new pinion seal was cheap and available at the local parts store.)

That's about all I can remember about all of this, and I sure hope it helps ya!

Good luck and holla back if you need anything.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 11:00 am 
Offline
LUVTruck.com Regular

Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 5:08 pm
Posts: 131
Location: Auburn, CA
Is the stock Pup rear end the same width as the LUV?

What about with my Long bed... anyone know what would be the best way to deal with the driveline since mine has a 2 piece?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: 5 speed swap
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 1:49 pm 
Offline
Newbie

Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2007 2:31 pm
Posts: 4
Location: Eastern Oregon
Thanks for all your time.........you are a wealth of information!
Curt in Oregon


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 5:33 pm 
Offline
PITA Old Fart

Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:33 am
Posts: 2286
Quote:
Is the stock Pup rear end the same width as the LUV?

What about with my Long bed... anyone know what would be the best way to deal with the driveline since mine has a 2 piece?


Yes, exactly the same.

The u-joints are identical, and both 2-piece drivelines are the same except for the front yoke for a stock Luv is a 10 spline and the newer pup front yoke should be a 17 spline or some other number of splines other than 10, plus the rear yoke on the pup driveline and the pinion yoke on the pup rear-end's bolt hole spacings are different than the Luv's.

As far as I know, the carrier bearings are the same - but don't quote me on that because I've never done a pup to luv rear-end swap in a long bed. Maybe someone else here has and they can let you know. But if all else fails, put the two beside each other and measure how they bolt up to see if the bolt spacings are the same..

And if you are going to swap rear-ends, you will have to exchange leaf springs or your wheels won't be centered in your rear wheel wells, and you will have to relocate the tab that the brake line junction box bolts to over to the other end of the pup rear end.

So as I said before, you have 3 choices if you are going to use your stock Luv tranny and just swap out your stock rear-end for a newer pup rear-end:

1. change your driveline's front yoke

2. change your driveline's rear yoke

3. change your rear-end's pinion yoke.

(Personally, I would yank the stock Luv 4 speed out and put in the newer pup 5 speed too while I got the truck up in the air - it bolts right in and everything on the pup driveline will match the pup tranny and the pup rear-end.)

Hope this all helps ya...good luck guys!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 8:27 pm 
Offline
Addicted to LUV
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 12:17 am
Posts: 1075
Location: porterville,cali
i put an 89 pup rearend in my 76 luv and the rearend is 1/2 inch off so i cut the leaf pads off with a die grinder and moved them over and welded them back on and i still need to do the trans

_________________
http://www.facebook.com/ez.cracker
dangerous-toys4life
73 3-door avalanche bdydropped on 18s
86 1-ton 4x crewcab short bd 15"lift
75 k-5 2x
94 king cab
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:46 pm 
Offline
Swap Specialist Mod
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 1:47 am
Posts: 2833
Location: Caldwell, Idaho
okay, i gues taz has already made the realization that i did tonite.

i didnt know that a later big bolt pattern rearend yoke could interchange with an earlier luv engine.

so knowin this now, swappin in the 5 speed is that much easier.

oh, and there are different u joint sizes in the later year isuzu drivelines. my 5 speed is out of a 91 isuzu pickup with a 2.3 and a cable clutch. it has u joints that are alot bigger than the early luv/pup drivelines.

but from what i learned tonite, the 5 speed swap is going to be easy as pie now.

all i have to do is bolt it in, get a tranny mount fabbed up, getting a cable clutch tranny to work in a hydraulic clutch truck, and get the yoke on the rearend swapped.

then ill be good to go.

_________________
"but its that gut feeling of you're drawn to what feels right for yourself and what you're passionate about..."

Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 6:55 pm 
Offline
Assimilated into LUVTruck.com
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2006 2:50 pm
Posts: 917
Location: Jeff City, Mo
need a sticky put up for this, I have described the swap in a 4 wheel drive before in pm's.
A fairly easy swap with no big major changes.

_________________
Too much to do and not enough time or money!
Courage is the other side of fear!
Pain is the weakness leaving the body!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 8:46 pm 
Offline
LUVTruck.com Lifer

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:34 pm
Posts: 798
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Farmer Joe wrote:
all i have to do is bolt it in, get a tranny mount fabbed up, getting a cable clutch tranny to work in a hydraulic clutch truck, and get the yoke on the rearend swapped. .



Tranny mounts are the same.

Should be able to use your fork and slave cly.


The tailshaft is the only drama.


Bob.

_________________
Current project, 1979 KB Isuzu Ute.
Image
Daily driver, '86 Rodeo Spacecab.
Chasing parts for Isuzu Impulse.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Sep 19, 2007 11:53 pm 
Offline
Addicted to LUV
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 12:17 am
Posts: 1075
Location: porterville,cali
i got mine out of a 89 and the shifter is like 4-6 inchs farther back i don't know if the 87 is the same

_________________
http://www.facebook.com/ez.cracker
dangerous-toys4life
73 3-door avalanche bdydropped on 18s
86 1-ton 4x crewcab short bd 15"lift
75 k-5 2x
94 king cab
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 21, 2007 1:24 am 
Offline
LUVTruck.com Lifer

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:34 pm
Posts: 798
Location: Melbourne, Australia
budbondo wrote:
i got mine out of a 89 and the shifter is like 4-6 inchs farther back i don't know if the 87 is the same


The 89 will be a 2.6L TF model. They had the MUA trans. These were fitted with a remote shifter. (I do believe that you guys got some TF's with T5 gearboxes.)


The 87 should still be the MSG box as used behind the G180Z motors. There were 3 different output shafts on these boxes. But the shifters are in the same spot.


Bob.

_________________
Current project, 1979 KB Isuzu Ute.
Image
Daily driver, '86 Rodeo Spacecab.
Chasing parts for Isuzu Impulse.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 12:21 am 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 10:32 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Vancouver, WA
budbondo wrote:
i put an 89 pup rearend in my 76 luv and the rearend is 1/2 inch off so i cut the leaf pads off with a die grinder and moved them over and welded them back on and i still need to do the trans


I have a 75 LUV, does anyone know if there are any direct swap-ins or should I plan on moving the spring perches too?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 1:31 am 
Offline
PITA Old Fart

Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 8:33 am
Posts: 2286
Like I said before, you don't have to cut/weld on the springs at all if you just put your old springs on the newer rearend everything will fit just fine.

The problem is that the newer Isuzu trucks had their spring mounts in a different location on the frame and their springs were totally different then the Luvs did, so when you try to use the newer springs it sets the rear wheels back about 2" rear of the center.

(This sometimes happens when you swap a newer rearend into an older vehicle.)

Your old springs will bolt right on the newer rearend and then everything will fit OK. The brakes and everything else should fit fine - except for the little mounting tab/bracket for the rear brake line junction box that will have to be re-located to the other side of the rearend housing, which is about a 5 minute job with a wire-feed welder.

It's a bit of a hassle - but to get better gas mileage and a much stronger rearend - IMHO it's worth it.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 8:38 am 
Offline
LUVTruck.com Lifer

Joined: Wed Aug 31, 2005 12:34 pm
Posts: 798
Location: Melbourne, Australia
If the diff is out of a newer than 88 model Isuzu you will probably find that the track is wider by about 2 inches.

Up till the end of the TFR pickup (02 i think) the spring mounting pads should be the same width but the later ones could be a bit wider apart as well as the track.


Bob.

_________________
Current project, 1979 KB Isuzu Ute.
Image
Daily driver, '86 Rodeo Spacecab.
Chasing parts for Isuzu Impulse.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:47 pm 
Offline
LUVTruck.com Guru

Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 12:37 am
Posts: 174
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
Isn't the 5 speed longer than the 4 speed? If so, that would require the driveshaft shortened, which is a pain in the neck if you're cheap like me. See this post:

http://forums.luvtruck.com/viewtopic.ph ... highlight=

Also, I think all Troopers have 2 piece driveshafts, but only the long bed Luvs have them. Is that correct?

_________________
You went there in that?!?!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jan 17, 2008 9:56 pm 
Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Wed Jan 16, 2008 10:32 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Vancouver, WA
Thanks tumwatertaz and rodeobob! :D

I missed the info with all the responses.


Well....my brother-in-law's little beater 2wd Isuzu pickup may just loose its drivetrain while he's on a business trip. :twisted:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 137 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 7  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group